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Cherskiy
Joined: 08 Dec 2006 Posts: 3701 Location: near Amble, Northumberland
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Posted: Fri Oct 31, 2008 12:48 pm Post subject: |
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Ian Robinson wrote: | John W wrote: | every complaint is valid. |
No they aren't. The show was broadcast at a specific time to an audience who know the sort of thing to expect.. |
So if I had tuned in by accident, let's say, in the midst of the calls*, would I have the right to complain even though I wouldn't normally have listened to RB's show because I don't like his 'brand' of "comedy"? Or is it that I shouldn't complain because this sort of thing is deemed acceptable between 2100 and 2300 on a Saturday night on R2?
(*When this show began, I did just that a few times before remembering not to go anywhere near R2 after 2100 and before 2300....)
Not trying to stir things, I'm simply interested in working out who has a right to complain about a particular presenter, programme or content. _________________ Author: “To the Ends of the Earth: A Snapshot of Aviation in North-Eastern Siberia, Summer 1992”
(Free to read via Kindle Unlimited) |
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sheltster
Joined: 11 Dec 2006 Posts: 61
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Posted: Fri Oct 31, 2008 12:50 pm Post subject: |
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If you had listened to the show then yes, complain if offended but anyone who complains that did not listen to it when broadcast is merely jumping on the Mail on Sunday bandwagon to rid themselves of two performers they don't like. _________________ Chris Evans' Breakfast - doesn't sound quite as good as Chris Evans' Drivetime but good nonetheless! |
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essexlady
Joined: 10 Dec 2006 Posts: 348 Location: Essex
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Posted: Fri Oct 31, 2008 1:59 pm Post subject: |
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I think you are mssing the point Shelster. I don't have to listen to a radio programme to know that leaving obscene messages on ANYONE'S answerphone is wrong. It's on the same level as cyber bullying and happy slapping - inexcusable by both teenagers and so-called celebrities and not even remotely funny. |
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sheltster
Joined: 11 Dec 2006 Posts: 61
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Posted: Fri Oct 31, 2008 2:00 pm Post subject: |
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Its nothing like happy slapping for goodness sake _________________ Chris Evans' Breakfast - doesn't sound quite as good as Chris Evans' Drivetime but good nonetheless! |
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John W
Joined: 07 Dec 2006 Posts: 3367 Location: Warwickshire, UK
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Posted: Fri Oct 31, 2008 2:07 pm Post subject: |
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sheltster wrote: | Its nothing like happy slapping for goodness sake |
Yes it is. You make a recording of an assault and laugh about it. You broadcast it or send it to everyone, so they can laugh about it.
Physical, mental, digital, whatever, bullying. There is no place on Radio 2 for bullying.
John W |
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Ian Robinson Site Admin
Joined: 11 Dec 2006 Posts: 3611 Location: Chorley, Lancashire
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Posted: Fri Oct 31, 2008 2:10 pm Post subject: |
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Cherskiy wrote: | Ian Robinson wrote: | John W wrote: | every complaint is valid. |
No they aren't. The show was broadcast at a specific time to an audience who know the sort of thing to expect.. |
So if I had tuned in by accident, let's say, in the midst of the calls*, would I have the right to complain even though I wouldn't normally have listened to RB's show because I don't like his 'brand' of "comedy"? Or is it that I shouldn't complain because this sort of thing is deemed acceptable between 2100 and 2300 on a Saturday night on R2?
(*When this show began, I did just that a few times before remembering not to go anywhere near R2 after 2100 and before 2300....)
Not trying to stir things, I'm simply interested in working out who has a right to complain about a particular presenter, programme or content. |
If you tuned in by accident and were offended... then complain. It's this bizarre situation of people seeking out material so they can be offended and complain about it that mystifies me.
I hate the PC culture of people being offended on behalf of other people. If those "other people" (like Andrew Sachs) wish to do something they should. But why should 30,000 complain on behalf of someone who doesn't?
As for any criminal wrong-doing... again, if Sachs wants to bring charges or not it's up to him. Nothing to do with any of us! |
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SantaFefan
Joined: 07 Dec 2006 Posts: 11258 Location: top of the cliffs in Norfolk
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Posted: Fri Oct 31, 2008 2:10 pm Post subject: |
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It slightly amazes me that the opinions of things being "overblown" or " it wasn't really that bad" seems to ignore the fact that there have been other incidents involving Russell Brand 0n R2 haven't there? the phone call to the police re a serial killer for example? or was that ok too.
I couldn't imagine Mark Radcliffe doing stuff like this... _________________ Johnnie Walker read out my message on Pirate Radio! 13/8/07
I have heard how radio should be. |
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Ian Robinson Site Admin
Joined: 11 Dec 2006 Posts: 3611 Location: Chorley, Lancashire
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Posted: Fri Oct 31, 2008 2:12 pm Post subject: |
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SantaFefan wrote: | there have been other incidents involving Russell Brand 0n R2 haven't there? the phone call to the police re a serial killer for example? or was that ok too. |
Wasn't that his live stage show, not Radio 2? |
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SantaFefan
Joined: 07 Dec 2006 Posts: 11258 Location: top of the cliffs in Norfolk
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Posted: Fri Oct 31, 2008 2:14 pm Post subject: |
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Oh was it? in that case I withdraw my point. _________________ Johnnie Walker read out my message on Pirate Radio! 13/8/07
I have heard how radio should be. |
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John W
Joined: 07 Dec 2006 Posts: 3367 Location: Warwickshire, UK
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Posted: Fri Oct 31, 2008 2:18 pm Post subject: |
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Ian Robinson wrote: | why should 30,000 complain on behalf of someone who doesn't?
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The BBC is a special case in that it is financed by 10million+ licences paid for by the public, so we all have a stake in it, and it should be answerable to all of us.
The BBC has had complaints about Douglas, Ross, Brand, Evans etc etc since each of them got involved with Radio 2. Remember Evans had 100s of complaints about his appointment in 2005. The BBC tried to ignore them and said on Feedback that Evans was the future.... blah blah
OK Evans isn't an obscene oaf and recently has improved his image. But the BBC succeeded in ignoring the hundreds of complaints.
This time, with Brand/Ross, it's thousands of complaints, not much more really, but the reason for the complaints is so much more important, and the BBC had to respond decisively.
John W |
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sheltster
Joined: 11 Dec 2006 Posts: 61
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Posted: Fri Oct 31, 2008 2:23 pm Post subject: |
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Just because thousands of people have decided to complain about a broadcast that the vast majority of them have not even heard does not mean that they are necessarily correct.
By your figures John, that makes 9,970,000 licence fee payers who have not complained _________________ Chris Evans' Breakfast - doesn't sound quite as good as Chris Evans' Drivetime but good nonetheless! |
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John W
Joined: 07 Dec 2006 Posts: 3367 Location: Warwickshire, UK
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Posted: Fri Oct 31, 2008 2:28 pm Post subject: |
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sheltster wrote: | Just because thousands of people have decided to complain about a broadcast that the vast majority of them have not even heard does not mean that they are necessarily correct.
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I'm not saying the 30,000 Brand/Ross complainers are correct. I'm saying I agree with them, and so does the senior management of the BBC.
I'm not saying the 100s of Evans complainers are correct. I'm saying I agree with them, but the senior BBC management does not.
that's the difference.
John W |
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Ian Robinson Site Admin
Joined: 11 Dec 2006 Posts: 3611 Location: Chorley, Lancashire
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Posted: Fri Oct 31, 2008 2:43 pm Post subject: |
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I do largely agree with you John, but the fact is the 500,000 people who actually listened to and enjoyed Russell Brand have just as much say as licence payers as the 30,000 people who complained.
A PSB broadcaster has a responsibility to cater to all tastes. I would say that LD ignored this responsibilty, but at least there was something there that younger people can say "I pay my tax, I listen." If the BBC doesn't take risks on people like this, then it may as well lose the licence fee and we'll all listen to Century FM clones for the rest of our lives.
(My issue with Brand all along has been that he's not Radio 2 material, not that he shouldn't be employed at all - despite the fact I don't find him funny or engaging). |
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MadeinSurrey
Joined: 11 Dec 2006 Posts: 3130 Location: The Beautiful South
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Posted: Fri Oct 31, 2008 2:49 pm Post subject: |
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"A PSB broadcaster has a responsibility to cater to all tastes!
Indeed, but surely the point of having Radios 1 & 2 as separate entities is so that those tastes can be catered for by division. Radio 2 really has lost the plot in that regard, and the departure of LD might be a way back. We can but hope! _________________ MiS |
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John W
Joined: 07 Dec 2006 Posts: 3367 Location: Warwickshire, UK
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Posted: Fri Oct 31, 2008 3:04 pm Post subject: |
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Ian Robinson wrote: | I do largely agree with you John, but the fact is the 500,000 people who actually listened to and enjoyed Russell Brand have just as much say as licence payers as the 30,000 people who complained. |
But even if those 500,000 come out and say that Brand/Ross's behaviour was acceptable doesn't mean they are correct. The BBC management have agreed with the 30,000 and the appropriate actions taken.
The lack of new public uproar since the Brand-Douglas exit suggests that the BBC management has taken the actions that most licence payers wanted.
Quote: | If the BBC doesn't take risks on people like this, then it may as well lose the licence fee and we'll all listen to Century FM clones for the rest of our lives. |
The BBC will only lose the licence fee if they lose say 90% of their listeners. Brand's exit will lose them a few %.
John W |
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sheltster
Joined: 11 Dec 2006 Posts: 61
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Posted: Fri Oct 31, 2008 3:08 pm Post subject: |
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The whole point is though that only two people who heard the broadcast complained - and that was because of the use of the F Word.
The rest are people who had no business complaining and Noel Gallagher is correct, it is typical of the English to be outraged 5 days after the programme was broadcast.
If the Mail on Sunday had not run this story, the vast majority of people on this board would not even be aware of the broadcast. _________________ Chris Evans' Breakfast - doesn't sound quite as good as Chris Evans' Drivetime but good nonetheless! |
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gfloyd
Joined: 07 Dec 2006 Posts: 4861 Location: Here, There, Everywhere.
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Posted: Fri Oct 31, 2008 3:14 pm Post subject: |
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sheltster wrote: | If the Mail on Sunday had not run this story, the vast majority of people on this board would not even be aware of the broadcast. |
As Gambo said those it was a time bomb waiting to go off. If it wasnt this one incident, it could have been any of the other dozen or so incidents that happened but werent picked up on. Plenty have complained before, but this was the galvinising incident that lead people in their masses to shout "ENOUGH" _________________ His name was ernie ........ and he drove the fastest milk cart in the west..... |
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John W
Joined: 07 Dec 2006 Posts: 3367 Location: Warwickshire, UK
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Posted: Fri Oct 31, 2008 4:43 pm Post subject: |
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gfloyd wrote: | If the Mail on Sunday had not run this story, the vast majority of people on this board would not even be aware of the broadcast. |
Eh, shelster. Look at the first posting of this thread dated 19 October. OK, Mark didn't go into detail but we do have to thank Mark and others who brought the episode to the attention of the press and to millions of licence-payers.
As Gambo has said sooner or later the behaviour of Brand was going to become very public. He was humiliating staff at the BBC, humiliating people with his phone pranks, he was like a runaway bus that eventually flew over the edge of the cliff and came to a crashing end. Somehow the bus driver on the day, Ross, is hanging on to life by a thread.
John W |
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Ian Robinson Site Admin
Joined: 11 Dec 2006 Posts: 3611 Location: Chorley, Lancashire
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Posted: Fri Oct 31, 2008 5:00 pm Post subject: |
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You may be interested to know Russell Brand's Ponderland on Channel 4 last night got it's highest-ever ratings. So who's the loser here...? |
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John W
Joined: 07 Dec 2006 Posts: 3367 Location: Warwickshire, UK
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Posted: Fri Oct 31, 2008 5:04 pm Post subject: |
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Ian Robinson wrote: | You may be interested to know Russell Brand's Ponderland on Channel 4 last night got it's highest-ever ratings. So who's the loser here...? |
It was a repeat, and it was heavily trailed. Curiousity I expect. |
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BDG
Joined: 08 Dec 2006 Posts: 202
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Posted: Fri Oct 31, 2008 5:06 pm Post subject: |
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I don't think the BBC need to be concerned about raitings wars? Why should they? It's getting caught up in the commercialisation that has led to such rubbish being aired on the BBC in the first place and I don't just mean Brand across the board. They get their money regardless of whether a million people watch or so or they don't.
It's the old old story of people's curiosity gets the better of them so they watch even if they don't like it. Bit like more accidents being caused when everyone slows down to gawk at a motorway pile up. |
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sheltster
Joined: 11 Dec 2006 Posts: 61
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Posted: Fri Oct 31, 2008 5:11 pm Post subject: |
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I don't think it will do Russell Brand any harm at all - his radio show was only a part of his profile. He is establishing himself in America and has a number of shows on C4.
He will probably do very well out of it, as will Georgina - as her exclusive interview in the Sun has proven.
Prior to this had anyone heard of the Satanic Sluts? _________________ Chris Evans' Breakfast - doesn't sound quite as good as Chris Evans' Drivetime but good nonetheless! |
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SantaFefan
Joined: 07 Dec 2006 Posts: 11258 Location: top of the cliffs in Norfolk
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Posted: Fri Oct 31, 2008 5:22 pm Post subject: |
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I don't mean to offend anybody but reading some of the posts here and on the Radio2 boards, it comes across to me that Russell's fans believe he can do and say whatever he likes.
Well, I'm glad he and Ross have been slapped down and I hope they've learnt a lesson.
Similar thing happened to Jade Goody didn't it... _________________ Johnnie Walker read out my message on Pirate Radio! 13/8/07
I have heard how radio should be. |
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sheltster
Joined: 11 Dec 2006 Posts: 61
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Posted: Fri Oct 31, 2008 5:32 pm Post subject: |
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Jade Goody - now there is someone who I really can't stand! _________________ Chris Evans' Breakfast - doesn't sound quite as good as Chris Evans' Drivetime but good nonetheless! |
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Lord Evan Elpuss
Joined: 10 Dec 2006 Posts: 3417 Location: Cloud Cuckoo Land
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Posted: Fri Oct 31, 2008 6:08 pm Post subject: |
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sheltster wrote: | He is establishing himself in America and has a number of shows on C4. |
How is he establishing himself in America? Publicly insulting their president didn't go down very well over there did it? _________________ Lord Evan Elpuss, Your ideal job is a Lumberjack. |
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Ian Robinson Site Admin
Joined: 11 Dec 2006 Posts: 3611 Location: Chorley, Lancashire
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Posted: Sat Nov 01, 2008 6:19 pm Post subject: |
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John W wrote: | Ian Robinson wrote: | You may be interested to know Russell Brand's Ponderland on Channel 4 last night got it's highest-ever ratings. So who's the loser here...? |
It was a repeat, and it was heavily trailed. Curiousity I expect. |
It wasn't a repeat. Hence the heavy trails |
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Ian Robinson Site Admin
Joined: 11 Dec 2006 Posts: 3611 Location: Chorley, Lancashire
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Posted: Sat Nov 01, 2008 6:21 pm Post subject: |
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Lord Evan Elpuss wrote: | sheltster wrote: | He is establishing himself in America and has a number of shows on C4. |
How is he establishing himself in America? Publicly insulting their president didn't go down very well over there did it? |
He's making a few more movies with the cool lot - and he must have done pretty well to even get that presenting gig in the first place.
Not that I think he's any good - but he's certainly got a good agent and publicist, and that's what Lesley Douglas fell for too. |
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